League Leaders Spurs in Ticket Office Farce

Ten days ago the Football Supporters Federation, the country’s largest representative organisation for football fans, published the results of a nationwide survey of club charters, documents that set out standards of customer service. Clubs were graded according to a number of criteria, including accessibility, timeliness, quality, complaints procedure and contact details. Sitting proudly on top of the table are the mighty Tottenham Hotspur, scoring an impressive 31 points out of a possible 35 and fully 8 points clear of our nearest rivals, Arsenal. Where’s your St Totteringham’s Day now, huh?

Try telling that to anyone who went for Real Madrid tickets yesterday morning. The charter is on the web, if you have the time and inclination to work out where anything is on that messy and counter-intuitive  official site. It’s glossy, carefully constructed in well-modulated, easy to read language and about as useful as Aaron Lennon in the air, because in reality Spurs treat fans with withering contempt.

Madrid was always going to be busy and frustrating because demand massively outweighs supply. The boards and sites were bulging with tales of joy and despair as the infamous online site maroon bar tantalisingly stuttered from left to right along the screen. As ever the abundant ingenuity of fans reached new heights of creativity. Entire offices mobilised online and on the phone in pursuit of a single ticket. Different, non-premium rate telephone numbers. One person I know queued for 12 hours at the ticket to be successful.

We all understand this. Until we have a bigger stadium, sadly many fans will be disappointed for the big games. However, what truly infuriates is the manner in which the club handles these moments. The disappointment is bearable, a sense of being kept in the dark and of the club not caring is not, especially when some problems are entirely avoidable.

Yesterday I logged on to the system at 12.10 on behalf of my son who wanted to register for a Chelsea away ticket – applications closed at 5pm and he wasn’t near a computer. On the home page of the official site there was no direct link to Madrid home tickets. Plenty of knockabout hilarious banter between JD and Bale over today’s international or the breaking news -hold tight to something solid – that Crouch was looking forward to that game. Nothing about the single most important thing that any fan wants to know about their club – match tickets.

I went onto the online ticket section to be greeted with the usual message about waiting a queue, don’t refresh you putz or you’ll lose your place. Nothing happened. About 20 minutes later a sliver of maroon appeared which steadfastly refused to budge for another half an hour. By 1.20 I was about an eighth of the way along, an hour later not much further.

This could only be due to one thing – people still believed they were in with a chance of Madrid tickets. Yet a messageboard post at 10.53 stated tickets had sold out. On the ‘forthcoming matches’ page Madrid was listed as sold out but you would not access this page if you clicked on ‘buy tickets’ and were taken straight into the system. Just after 2 I had another go on a different browser. This time, a message came up saying the tickets had gone but people who logged on hours earlier had no way of knowing this – “don’t refresh” and still nothing on the home page of the main site.

About 2.30 I suddenly shot across to 75%, then was unceremoniously booted off just gone 3. My son called the box office who confirmed my suspicions – so many supporters had by this time been left hanging in the wind for at least 4 hours since tickets had ceased to be available. The club said they were intending to clear the system and start again.

This doesn’t affect me personally as I’m fortunate enough to have a season ticket. My original standing season ticket lapsed in the late 80s when my children were young and family life was busy. As they grew older, we started going regularly to matches and bought season tickets in 1999 (no waiting list back then) because of the increasing problems of getting members tickets for important matches. Even if we couldn’t go to every game, it was still worth it. Yet yesterday makes my blood boil because better communication and a better system could have prevented the frustration and anguish of my fellow fans. It’s made all the more insulting because of the mealy mouthed empty platitudes of the Charter written by club mandarins who keep themselves as far away from the unwashed public as they possibly can. Here’s a bloody charter for you from this fan.

Tell people what’s going on. We are old enough and ugly enough to handle bad news. What we don’t like is being the mushrooms under the crap, kept in the dark. Have clear, updated ticket information on the club home page. If I could do that in 30 seconds on my pony blog, then that’s easy for you too. Use the £3.70 admin fee you charged for the costs of the electric pulse that uploaded my ticket purchase onto my season ticket card, there’s probably about £3.699999 left over.

If tickets have sold out, clear the system and replace it with an up to date message. If the start time for tickets is 9.30, don’t allow people on the system before then, thus avoiding the myths circulating about when you can and can’t log on in the mornings.

The loyalty points system is not perfect but it’s the best we have and by far the fairest way of selling tickets. Use it for games like this. Publicise a number in advance, you can’t apply for a ticket unless you have, say, 200 points. Once you meet that threshold, it’s first come first served. Not perfect as I say, but better that what happens now.

I know nothing about the logistics of ticketing but these measures are straightforward. Perish the thought that any of this might cost the club money…

In my experience the individuals at the club ticket office, including the manager, are very helpful. When Paul Barber was at the club, he used to reply to genuine concerns and enquiries personally, via his Blackberry sometimes. The current system is better than in the old days. My first game at Spurs was against Sheffield United in 1967. As it was the final home game before the Cup Final, ballot cards were distributed at the turnstiles, so I could have obtained a Final ticket on the basis of attending precisely a single game. However, the system could so easily be improved. As for the Charter, not worth the glossy paper it’s written on and the FSF, noble though they are, would be better off surveying the actual experiences of fans with clubs who depend to a large extend on taking our money. About time they put some effort into treating us better.

 

62 thoughts on “League Leaders Spurs in Ticket Office Farce

  1. There are so many issues it is impossible to list them all….
    What is a concern is that there were (at a rough guess) less than 10k available, I am no database engineer, but I reckon I could build a system that would be able to sort out some kind of metric on length of membership, number of points, time logged on and then allocate all the tickets and be all sorted out within a few minutes.

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    • Exactly. It’s the injustice of it all and the hypocrisy of the Charter. I’ve been involved in creating two charters to do with work. They are worthless if there is no substance behind them.

      Regards,

      Al

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      • As a few other comments say as well, to organise a clear application process is pretty much a schoolboy with and excel spreadsheet and a filter….
        Much like for Wembley games – throw your application in, and based on criteria that are clear and understood by all the allocation is made.
        There does have to be (in my opinion) some priority given to people who have held membership longer, been to some “lower” games.

        But, as has been said here, the fact the club were actually promoting Bronze only weeks ago as the only way to get to these games shows that they want the £40 and don’t give a flying one about your chances.
        While there is no legal case, there is a clear moral case here in my view.
        If, as reported, these tickets will potentially be going for £1000 up, selling a membership card becomes a very lucrative business for those who joined and got a ticket…

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  2. The same problem happened to me with the AC Milan tickets. I spent 4 hours on the ticket website and as I neared the completion to access the site, it shot me back. This repeatedly happened and I spent a hour on the phone to try and explain the problem, but no one picked up. I emailed the ticket office and surprise, surprise, no one has ever got back to me. They know that if it was anything other than football and you got treated like rubbish, you would take your business elsewhere. So we just have to suffer as you choose your team for life.

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    • This happens every time we have a big game. It is a lottery but i have to say that the ticket office have been extremely helpful to me when the system has thrown me out when I was just about to pay for tickets. This season I have failed to get tickets for Inter AC and now Real. It is frustrating but you have to accept that for these games we have lots of supporters but Stoke, West Brom Blackpool and Birmingham were relaltively easy to obtain using the same method so loyalty points have to become inportant.

      The policy setters at Spurs are not very good at customer service – when we weren’t that good it probably didn’t matter much but what they have to understand is that we have jobs to do as well as muck around getting tickets for matches and we cannot give up a whole morning to these types of exercises just because….

      Unfortunately the whole game is run like this. Like politicians they know what is best for us and we just have to take whatever medicine gets dished out!

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  3. The away ticket situation is no better. Has anyone who applied to Thomas Cook travel heard anything yet about whether or not they have a ticket?

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        • I still haven’t heard anything despite thomas cook telling me they which is a joke seeing as the game isn’t that far away. Would like to know if anyone knows cut off point as will try looking for alternative ways of getting there!

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  4. It would all have been worth it if once you get past the queuing stage you can actually get your hands on a ticket. At 10.30 I was finally admitted, navigated straight to the Madrid tickets page to see a stadium with an abundance of orange. We’re in business I thought, however after trying a few blocks that were not sold out in the south lower I couldn’t get 2 tickets together. I proceeded to try every other block in the ground that wasn’t sold out and the same thing so in my desperation tried getting one by itself and another elsewhere, still no joy. It would be so much easier if you could just put in that you want 2 tickets anywhere and it gives them to you. Absolute joke of a website.

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    • For the big games you will rarely get tickets together particulalry in the most sought after areas. We are a 4 and i try for 2 to put5 the lads otgether then buy singles. Looking for a 4 would either cost a fortune in East or West or be sold out.

      The colours dont always follow as quickly as they should

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  5. Good shout – if you gave awards based on what people tell you rather than what they do then Mario Balotelli would have just won world player of the year after 5 years of domination by Nickawage Bendtner, and Arse would have a full trophy cabinet at the theatre of nightmares.
    But, in defense of Spurs this is why we need to get a bigger boat. I know the scum tried it before but I really think we should look at Wembley for these kind of games in future, and who knows, maybe permanently. A 90,000 seater stadium empty for most of the season, with its own tube station, and ample parking, on no one elses doorstep, 10 minutes round the norh circ from our current home – even if we closed the top tier your looking at a 60,000 capacity.
    Thinkaboutit.

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  6. I think we should all boycott one of the lesser games at home then see if they take notice of the loyalty points scandal! I’m outraged by this system where someone who bought a membership last week has the same chance as me with 300+ loyalty points. All the money I’ve spent going to games supporting this club through the bad times and I get treated like this when things become rosy. I can’t begin to say how angry I am, too the point where I actually hope we get trounced in Madrid so they can see how many of those ‘loyal’ fans with tickets turn up and cheer then.

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    • Agree 100% I wonder how many new members got a ticket online yesterday!!

      However I think length of time of loyalty points is a priority in getting tickets how do you build loyalty points if you can’t get tickets regularly?

      10% off and a Birthday card thats all and a hope of a season ticket one sunny day!!

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  7. In reply to SpursSimon I can confirm that when I spoke to the ticket office they told me there was only 4,000 tickets available for 65,000 members for the AC Milan game, which begs the question why are Spurs taking around £40 per member x 65,000 when only 1 in 16 has a chance of getting a ticket? Apparently UEFA and therir cronies took over 2,000 tickets for AC Milan and have demanded more for Real Madrid!
    I got into the queue at 8:30 yesterday and failed to get a ticket, and as other people experienced the bar got to about 80% then dropped back to around 30% then the All Tickets Sold came up. My son went online 5 mins. after me and got a ticket fairly quickly (by 09:40) Surely this proves getting a ticket is a bit of a lottery and there has to be a better way. I agree the loyalty points system is the best we can hope for but it doesn’t come into play for big CL games. I think there could be a very simple way of using the loyalty points system for these big games or even giving say 5 points for each CL game attended inc. the qualifier then members with 25 points (all 5 CL games + qualifier so far) would almost be guaranteed a ticket. If any left over then 20 points. Members would then have a fair idea of whether they would get a ticket.

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    • that’s ridiculous! It doesn’t matter what competition we are in you show support and loyalty in them all. Not just pick out the champions league because its the most glamorous. Members that travel up and down the country every other week to games like wigan, bolton, stoke etc. and have the loyalty points total to show this should get tickets before some fair weather fan who only goes to champions league home games.

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    • The big games have only 1 loyalty point as everyone wants tickets but the weaker fixtures have 5 to reward you for turning up and being a supporter. I got tickets for Young boys, Bremen and Twente but not for Inter. I managed for Liverpool, Chelsea, Arsenal and Man Utd because i get 2 goes with the extra day. We don’t get an extra day for the Champions league because they don’t know when the fixtures are going to be.

      I cannot see why we dont get that extra day as we paid extra to try and get it and that is our potential season ticket list. Any tickets available would fall to this list but it would be fair to place a loyalty point number on it to allow some sort of general sale to vanilla members.

      At the present time loyalty points are only used for finals and semi finals at a neutral system and probably for deciding which season ticket holders get itckets at away games in London. I think the club should review this policy and operate it for every category 1 game/opponent in every competition as this is where the mega demand comes in. If that were used the ticketing system would not come under the extreme pressure and fall over.

      What the club need to realise is that as they do better on the field they need to do better off it and it really is quite easy to do it if they take time out to think it through.

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  8. If you bring in loyalty points for big home games those members who have built them up over the years will always get the tickets (same as the season ticket holders for away games). = Ageing fanbase as the younger kids will never get a chance & you won’t be able to take your kids.Its pot luck – always has been for massive games.Queue up overnight like the old days. Even with a new ground (60000) games like this will be oversubscribed.

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    • It doesn’t matter loyalty points is the only fair way of doing it. You could always take kids to the family matches to build them up for a few years then as they get older take them to the bigger games. Just because someone has children should they be placed above someone without.

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  9. Shambolic.

    How difficult would it have been to to have software that allocated the tickets based on loyalty points as follows:

    1. A cut off date is given to make applications:

    2. Assuming there are 10,000 tickets, and 14,000 applications, the club would announce (e.g.) that those with 453 points who made application on time are guaranteed tickets.

    3. Assuming that this accounted for 9555 tickets, the remaining 445 tickets would be balloted among those members with 452 points.

    3. The Ballot would consist of drawing letters out of a hat. If your name began with “T” and T as the first letter drawn, you get a ticket, and you carry on drawing letters until these are exhausted. Eventually, you might get down to 8 tickets and 14 applications. These can be allocated by a random draw.

    Result: all the tickets can be allocated in a couple of hours by someone capable of using an excel spreadsheet.

    There is an acronym used in business: KISS. It means “KEEP IT SIMPLE, STUPID”.

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    • Spot on! I wonder how many of these ‘fans’ will stick around if we get knocked out by Real and finish 6th in the Premiership. They can all turn up in a couple of weeks time and chant ‘I weren’t here when we were shit’ and touts can laugh all the way to the bank! Well Done Spurs!

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  10. Thanks for all the comments.

    Think I might send the link to the ticket office on Monday. Constructive criticism, genuine suggestions to make it better.

    Regards,

    Al

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      • I don’t think you should knock fairweather fans (I’m presuming by this you mean people with less ‘loyalty points’ than you).If the club advertises (openly last week) 2010/2011 memberships -for christs sake its nearly april – so as to book for this one game then their position is clear – they are interested in Income and increasing the fanbase and lots of it – increased corporate and sponsorship lolly and don’t care one iota about your loyalty cos you’ll be back next year whatever & will not introduce loyalty based criteria for home games. More likely they will introduce a Super A* grade game & ramp up the admission charges.

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      • I agree with Woody Green about the loyalty points. During the group stage, the long standing fans got priority. However, some supporters, like me, feel just as strongly for the club as any other fan but wasn’t born early enough to acure the required points.

        The system is a lottery and that’s much less a biased process than the loyalty point scheme which was bordering on ageist.

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        • Steve I don’t think you are right. I bought a bronze membership this year to get to the CL games but then found when first went on sale that no extra day was going to exist for the CL because they are cup matches. Therefore loyalty points were not used.

          As regards it being ageist my 15 year old got a ticket in the ballot for Man U at Wembley and also for Portsmouth. He did not for Chelsea but i scraped home. We have attended most home matches in recent years but not all before that and the ticket system was reset sometime in last 6 years i think. To give yourself a chance you must do the all the 3 and 5 point games

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        • It’s not a biased process, It’s a fair process and not at all ageist. I’m 23 and have over 300 loyalty points because I’ve spent my hard earned money going up and down the country watching my team over a good few years now. So tell me why someone who becomes a member purely to watch this one game deserves the same chance as me to get that ticket?

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  11. I got a ticket for this game, I’m a member and have been for around 5 years. I cant afford to go to many games, maybe one or two a year, so why should I not be allowed to get a ticket just because I have less money than you? I also have a young son and a baby and I cannot leave them every week to watch football matches. I also wouldn’t have help with childcare as my husband works alot of hours and I work also. So I will go and enjoy the rare opportunity to get to a match. Or maybe I should give it to someone richer than myself??

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    • It’s not about how rich you are and I’m not questioning genuine fans love for the club but the only fair way to allocate these tickets is by using the loyalty point system. All the club has done by letting it be a free for all to get tickets has encouraged touts to take that gamble. Tickets are on sale online for prices topping £500. Surely you can understand that someone who turns up to games week in week out home or away should be treated with the respect and loyalty they deserve from the club.

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      • And I dont just go to the best games either. I go to the cheaper games too, and have done this for the last 5 years. Also didn’t they stop selling the memberships a few weeks ago for this season? I think it’s fair as everyone has a right to support their club. Im not a fair-weather fan I’ve supported them since 1990 and we haven’t done too well until recently have we?! I didn’t bother going online to get my ticket I phoned as I’ve problems getting tickets online before.

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  12. So if you are so poor watch it on tv. simple. I bought the pre season tickets for 16 home games almost a season ticket without having one. I also went to the carling cup game, the mancity game and the young boys match. so 19 games i have paid for this season and wouldnt have got the loyalty points if that was the case, but i agree would have been the fairest way to do this. my problem here though is the mechansim for getting tickets online it is attrocious.

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      • It costs me around £100 to go to see spurs, plus I don’t one leaving my kids all the time. So you’re saying I shouldn’t go at all? Well I got a ticket an you didn’t? Go eat those sour grapes!

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        • No you’re saying that. I said go if you can afford to. I don’t care if you have children that was your choice. Although you’re arguing with the grammar and intellect of a child so I’m not surprised this is all going over your head.

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  13. Terrific article again Alan let’s hope the Club take note of some of the points made. It is actually for their benefit in the end if they get the customer service correct as West Ham have home tickets available now and certainly will do in a few years time.

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  14. If you pay for a season ticket you are fortunate enough to be guaranteed a seat for the home matches it covers. There are lots of people who would love to swap places with you but can’t (mostly to do with ground capacity) and so please don’t be greedy enough to want priority for cup matches (and way games) too. I am a northern-based supporter of 44 years who has spent many thousands of pounds supporting my club around the country, but I’ll never be in the position to benefit from the loyalty scheme in place. So I would like to see changes made for the benefit of ‘out-of’-towners’ like myself, and also for the (disadvantaged) younger fans mentioned above.
    My system would be a ballot for season ticket holders, members and non-members with a fixed , reducing percentage allocation for each category. For anyone in the first group who is unsuccesful, their names are added to the members draw and, again, if unsuccesful, they would be included in the non-members draw. In this way, an individual will have three, two or one chance of a ticket (or pair of tickets) depending on the level of paid support for the club. It may sound complicated but it seems to be a fairer system where everyone has hope of getting a ticket. The mechanics of the process might need fine tuning and automation, so please feel free to develop the idea further.

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  15. The comments are almost as interesting to read as the article. Personally I believe loyalty points do need to be considered but not in the simple way they are now.

    I know of one fan who is going to this game after not being to a game in three years. His reasoning behind this is that he hasn’t been able to afford it which is utter garbage. Any football fan can afford at least one game a season no matter what they earn. If they decide to spend their money on something else that is entirely up to them and doesn’t mean they love spurs any less than someone who goes every week. However, for a game like this it should mean they don’t have an equal chance of getting a ticket as that person. I also know someone who has been to many home and away games including throughout Europe this season who didn’t get a home ticket. This is not on.

    Personally I didn’t even try to get a ticket because I knew it would be mayhem and the price of the tickets are ridiculous. My loyalty points are fairly high but that’s because I choose to attend the less glamourously games and travel to away games where you collect more points. However I only attend about 10 games a season. If I had tried to get a ticket and friends of mine who go every week didn’t I wouldn’t think that was fair. If You’re someone who believeS it is, then I’m sorry but you’re wrong.

    To go purely on loyalty points though is wrong too because the majority of fans for some reason want to see spurs play in cat a games so if young fans or new fans or fans with few loyalty points could never go to cat a games some would never go at all. Personally I believe the club can do without those fans but I doubt the bank manager would agree. The system would need to be revised to possibly include a cat a* which could be champions league games and the north london derby where loyalty points are taken into account. Then games against united, Liverpool and chelsea could be the normal cat a games etc as they are now.

    If I could give anyone some advise. If you love spurs it should be equally as enjoyable going to watch them play Stoke the Saturday before Madrid as I will be. That’s also cheaper and 4 more loyalty points. If you’re only in it for the so called big games, I wouldn’t expect you to be in for much longer.

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    • I wouldn’t go to the Britannia this Saturday as we will be playing at Wigan. I’ll be there with three nieces and nephews all born and bred in the NW. We deserve a crack at getting tickets for the big home and CL away games.

      Like

  16. I too got a ticket, I am a lifelong fan and only go to maybe one or two games a year, due to my financial situation and because my work involves working weekends. I also have to pay £30 for a Train ticket to the game. I’m a member but lost my loyalty points as I Didnt renew my membership for two years due to losing my job and having a family to support. I dont think I should be banned from going because of this. I am also to see us play Birmingham this season. I think every spurs fan has a right to go to this memorable game, no matter how much time or money we have to follow our club.

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  17. I am a fortunate enough to have a season ticket. Just wondered why some of you don’t get one if you go to every single game? You’d save money I’m sure. Then you’d be guaranteed a ticket to every single game. I am going to both the home and away leg against Real Madrid as I have over 1000 loyalty points and a season ticket, if you were as dedicated as me you’d be in the same situation, particularly you ‘Yiddokid’, I deserve to go as I devote my life to following my team and never ever miss a game.

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      • Yes young lad, no need for rudeness. I’m older and wiser than you are. You seem very young, what are you about 17/18? You’ll have plenty of time for games like these when you get your season ticket. I’m 61 and took early retirement to follow spurs ten years ago, I’m an old man now and I deserve to go more than you as I’m older, wiser and richer than you are. As that seems to be your opinion of others.

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        • You clearly don’t understand my point of view, I’ll put that down to old age. I couldn’t care less how old you are and I didn’t ask for your life story. The fact is I should be at this game, or at least have a very good shout, because I have 300 loyalty points. whose to say we will get to this stage again. We definitely don’t deserve to as a club if they don’t know how to treat fans.

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  18. As the good Doctor W says, the comments are as good as the article.

    I’ve forwarded this to the ticket office manager, asking him to read it. Conciliatory, I hope.

    One thing I’ve learned since I started blogging. Arguments about who is a ‘real’ supporter, a ‘better’ supporter, are futile. We all care for the team, whether we are able to go to one or all of the games.

    Regards,

    Al

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  19. I hope you bickering lot were 100% behind the move to Stratford?!! It’s simple maths this – 65,000 members into 34,500 seats = new stadium. If everyone on this forum got a ticket for Real Madrid, then there would be another forum somewhere with another thousand hard luck stories.

    Why dont you put your efforts into petitioning Haringey Council/Mayor Boris to muster up some cash to help us regenerate the stinking shit hole that surrounds our currnet home?

    Pin

    Like

  20. Pingback: It's Not Like the Good Old Days thfc1882.com

  21. my god. sheffied united 67. my first game too!! 2-0, the sheer thrill of walking down the high road and seeing the floodlights in the distance for the first time. week before the cup final. all the houses and shops decked out in blue and white. goosebumps. jumpers for goalposts and all that. who’d have guessed that 44 years later i’d be left cursing at a computer screen as i watched a moronic maroon bar randomly going backwards and forwards as if my life depended on it. didn’ t get a ticket , like most others. the system is a disgrace. going to madrid instead, bought on the madrid general sale. olah!!

    Like

  22. i have 6 tickets for the spurs end in madrid any offers as only need 3 so 3 tickets next to each other
    can pick them up from me or meet out there but traveling out on sun pm via murcia then will be in madrid on tue morn.

    Like

  23. Hi guys,
    I’m a Real Madrid supporter from Spain. Due to some travel arrangements my friends and I have seven consecutive tickets available for RealMadrid-Tottenham Champions League match in Madrid next April 5th. (Price: 175 pounds/each)
    If you are interested, contact me at: m_cabezasg@yahoo.es.
    Thanks.

    Like

  24. Hi I’ve 2 seats in west stand upper, can’t go due to work commitments, anyone interested in my tickets? They’re on mine and my mates membership cards. Could lend them as long as they’re posted back to me…

    Like

  25. Bring back the 80’s and the ballot card draws!!!! so happens that i stood in the middle of the shelf with all the other ‘erberts singing our hearts out( and bundling over the peanut man!!) but so happens i won the cup final ballot every time… strange that, looll………….. coys

    Like

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